When Great Grads Can’t Get Hired

SPEAKER_01 0:00

They're home living in their old room, and they just graduated from this great school, worked hard, great GPA, internships, and can't get a job. The parents often think, well, you're not applying enough. And that's that's the real misconception. It's not about numbers, it's about strategy.

SPEAKER_00 0:14

Welcome to this Empty Nest Life, the podcast dedicated to helping you embrace this transformative season with purpose, passion, and joy. In each episode, we explore stories, strategies, and insights to help turn your empty nest into an exciting new chapter. Whether you're redefining your identity, pursuing new passions, or finding peace in the pause, you're in the right place. Here's your host, the Empty Nest coach, Jay Ramsden.

From Empty Nest Parent To Coach

SPEAKER_02 0:36

Hey there, my emptiness friends. One of the biggest stressors in the emptiness transition is watching our adult children navigate the real world, specifically the job market. We want them to find their footing, we want them to be financially independent, but the world they are entering looks nothing like the one that we started in. Today we're joined by Deborah Shaw. Debora is the founder of Grads Hired and a Powerhouse Career Strategist. She's here to help us understand our new role from being the manager of our kids' lives to being the career coach and consultant they actually want to listen to when the job search isn't going as planned. Deborah, welcome to this emptiness life.

SPEAKER_01 1:18

Thank you so much for having me.

SPEAKER_02 1:20

I love that you're here because when this goes to air, people are going to be like, my kid, they graduated and now they're home and they don't know what to do. And I'm not sure how to help them. And I would imagine you have a lot of people who come to you for that. And there's probably one big mistake you see them make when they're trying to help their adult kids find a job. I know I probably could have used some of your advice when my son spent eight months looking for a job. So what is the number one mistake that parents make when the kids are stumbling through the job search?

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Yeah. So I would say that the number one mistake is they tell them just apply more or you need to network. But there's so much nuance that goes into that because just spamming resumes out everywhere is not

Why “Apply More” Backfires

SPEAKER_01 2:05

at all effective and really becomes a defeatist strategy for these grads. They get so discouraged and so disgusted, and then they feel like it's me. I'm not good enough for these jobs because it's depressing that they're home living in their old room and they just graduated from this grade school, worked hard, great GPA, internships, and can't get a job. So parents often think, well, you're not applying enough. And that's that's the real misconception. It's not about numbers, it's about strategy. And number two is telling them just network, they don't really understand what that means. So I see new grads all the time think that networking means, oh, I reached out to a hiring manager and I sent them an email with my resume and asked if they had any open positions for me.

SPEAKER_02 2:48

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Networking. Let's not networking at all. But and I can see where they go down that path for sure. I I have found too with people I've spoken to is that they'll even say, I have somebody that you can talk to about just this in industry, and they're like leery to even do that. Do you see that too?

SPEAKER_01 3:10

I do see that too, because oftentimes I'll see parents say, We're so connected. We have so many connections. If your kid doesn't know how to walk through the door that you're opening, the connections are useless. So parents often think, Oh, my kid has all the finesse and nuance that I know. And they don't. So they don't know. So even if it's like a colleague of a parent or a friend or whatever, and they say, Hey, you really should reach out to this person, they don't even know how to reach out. They don't know what to say to start the conversation. So it's really as rudimentary as teaching them how to do that effectively, because that's makes all the difference in the world.

SPEAKER_02 3:45

Okay. So what would be the one tip there? I think because that's super helpful for somebody who's Yeah. I open the door, but they don't know what to say when they get there.

SPEAKER_01 3:54

So the first major issue is they have to research the person and the company. Because if you're genuinely interested in reaching out to somebody, you have to know about them. And that's a real issue. So research the company, research the person, and get into a deep dive. Where did they go to school? Where did they start out? What projects have they worked on that are maybe interesting to you? Spark conversation. And then that's a really good way to open the door. Hey, I noticed you went to, you know, XYZ. How was your experience there? How did you get started in this field? I'm so inspired by what you're working on. Do you have any time for a cup of coffee so we could discuss it? I'd love to hear more about what you do. Yeah, targeted, yeah, about them. Because everybody wants to be able to, oh, I want to tell you about how great I am. That's a it's a much better approach than just, hey, I know you know my dad. And is there any way that you have time for me? That you've done you've you've put no effort in and you've shown me that I don't really have time. I'm super busy. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_02 5:00

Yeah. Almost I'm thinking like almost down to like if they're in the office, say, hey, I could meet you at blah blah blah for 15 or 20 minutes on Tuesday or Thursday next week, which worked better.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Yes. Absolutely. I I actually follow this professor of entrepreneurship from Duke University. He's incredible. Can't think of his name, Aaron something. Anyway, he's an amazing. Yes. And he often says, you know what? Everybody says, let's get a cup of coffee. If you want to stand out, say, hey, can I buy you a milkshake? Who doesn't want to go have a milkshake? And it's such a cute little distinction

Real Networking That Actually Works

SPEAKER_01 5:35

that is maybe if somebody asked me, hey, can I go buy you a milkshake and pick your rain? I'd be like, you bet. I'll go for a milkshake.

SPEAKER_02 5:43

Actually, something different. Yeah. Yes. I like it. Like just something totally out of the norm. Yes. Okay. Yeah. So we know today's job market, even for us, you know, I see this with my friends who are in their 50s and they're being go of the big jobs because they out downsize out because they want to hire young people who make less money. Sure. That job market's different, but also it's different for the kids to even navigate. So, like, from that point of view, like, what do you share with people to say, yeah, this is how it's different than when we went looking for jobs? The networking thing wasn't really a thing. Right. It was, but people didn't talk about it. And I know people think networking is gross and it feels yucky, like they have a concept. Yeah. How has the market, the job market, changed? What's what are kids missing now? I think when we talked before, you said something about being invisible.

SPEAKER_01 6:40

We used to be able to print out our resume at Kinko's, put on a nice outfit, and walk into a place, hand it to receptionists. They would take a look at you. Oh, you look like you're you're not a serial killer and you could potentially do this job. Let me bring you in to talk with somebody. Um, that visibility is gone. They are now applying into black holes. And that is the real problem. That's why the theory of apply more just isn't effective. Because what's happening is they're all applying into these easy apply or apply here buttons, and recruiters are never even seeing who they are because they're getting hundreds, sometimes thousands of resumes for one position. They don't know who those AI is sifting through. If you if you have anything off with your resume that an application tracking system doesn't like, you're gone. So the visibility piece is completely missing, the person to person. So that's why it's so important. We need to find a way to make these kids visible to employers. In fact, I just read an article, I think it was in Good Morning America, just posted something about this kid that was trying to get hired, couldn't get hired, dressed up as a delivery driver, brought 40 boxes of donuts with his resume taped inside with some little cute note about how, hey, my resume will end up not in your belly, but in your mind. And I hope you'll consider me. He got 10 interviews. Genius.

SPEAKER_02 7:59

I I tried something that myself back in the day. And it was like, I gave it all, and I was like at the end, it was like, would I I put a penny in every letter and was like, would appreciate a penny of your thoughts about this position in me as a match. I didn't get any interviews from it because I think back then that was way out of the norm.

SPEAKER_01 8:19

Right.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

People, I did get a couple back that are like, that's pretty good, but it does not a match for us. At least I gotta respond.

unknown 8:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:26

Yeah, no, that would that would be very effective today. That's a good one.

SPEAKER_02 8:31

All right, I'm about 40 years too late. The the parent who's listening is going, well, that seems kind of like cheeky and dorky, the like the donut thing. What would you say to that?

SPEAKER_01 8:42

So that is true. And I get it, that's not for everyone, and that's certainly not in my framework of what I start with. I'm certainly not advising kids to go do those kinds of things. However, anything that you can do to think outside the box to get yourself known or visible. Now, let's back up. This works best when this process starts while they're in college. However, I realize that's not the case. Lots of people wait till they come home. But if you are listening and you still have a kid in college, anything that you can do to get that ball rolling while they're there, meaning talking to professors, joining professional clubs, going to the networking events, certain professors would host events at their home, even. And it was like a big thing with all these other industry people. And go to those events, do those things, shake the hands, because so many students don't go. They don't do any of it. And then they they leave and all those resources are gone when they graduate and walk across that stage. True, right? In theory, you still have the alumni network, of course, but while you're there, oh, that is that is the time. And the it's a the unfortunate thing is that career centers and all of that extra fluff that so many universities, almost all of them offer, is not baked into the cake of the educational experience. So the onus is on the student to seek it out, and you they usually don't. So if you have a kid in college, definitely utilize resources while

Escaping The Online Application Black Hole

SPEAKER_01 10:05

they're there. Now, if they're home, what I encourage somebody to do, and I have like a little starting guide so it's less overwhelming, is to research five, 10, 15 companies that you could see yourself working for. Company, and I'm not talking about don't reach for the stars, don't go for Google and Tesla right out of the gate. But those are more reach situations. But don't discount small business and think about where I could be nurturing communication and conversations and potential relationships with these people. I teach students how to find the right people in those companies and then what to say to them.

SPEAKER_02 10:41

So good. So good. I like the idea of doing it early, right? More and more schools are starting to start the college process early. Like freshman year you get some and software, you get some more. But in college, it seems like they haven't caught up to that part for their career track in terms of even encouraging the kids to use it and figure out how to how to network and how to bring people in and have conversations and make use of the resources like professors, etc. But I would imagine when you don't do that and then you launch and you start just doing the apply more everywhere sort of thing, that probably leads to a little bit of job search burnout. Yeah, that's doomsday. How can parents like A spot signs of that and B offer encouragement without it seeing overreach or adding pressure?

SPEAKER_01 11:25

Yeah. So what the telltale signs of that are I know I'm working on it. These are the things I would hear from my student. I know, mom, I'm working on it. Okay. Can you tell me about any of the conversations you've had with any employers? That's a really great, great open-ended question to ask. Because if you just say, Are you applying to jobs? Yeah, yeah, I'm applying. Okay, great. Have you had any conversations with employers? Because that's gonna go, oh no, I haven't had any conversations. No. Okay, I think that maybe you need to look at this a little bit more granularly and focus on have you researched any of maybe alumni from your school that work at this company? Oh no. So things like that are very helpful. But asking open-ended questions, not just have you applied more, but who have you had a conversation with at the company?

SPEAKER_02 12:19

Yeah, that's so good. Because it's uh closed-ended questions give you a yes or no, just like they do about homework, right? Yes. And start thinking of job searching as homework, I'm doing, I'm I did it. I'm working on it. I know, mom. I know, mom. I know.

SPEAKER_01 12:31

Yeah, uh-huh. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 12:32

You talk about research, and I'm assuming like LinkedIn is kind of like now the modern town square for careers. Do you teach the kids that work with you about how to maximize that and what does that look like?

SPEAKER_01 12:42

Yeah, that's interesting because if you have a child that's a business major in any university, they are gonna get so much of that in the program. Like, for example, my son is a business major at the University of Oklahoma and he's in the entrepreneurship program. And one of the requirements in one of these classes is he has to have 500 LinkedIn connections by the time he graduates. That is very advantageous because that already gets the ball rolling. So, of course, connections are important. Link alumni at your school is very important. But I also have a a couple really good ways to search for jobs on LinkedIn that may be unthought of, just in terms of what's native to them. So it can, it's it's more helpful in pinpointing entry-level positions in their field and specifically who's running the job, which is of course the key because that's the person we want to be friendly with. But the most important thing, Jay, is that before all of the applying or any of that starts, they have to be known. They have to start the conversations. So, yes, in essence, yes, I'm teaching them how to without cringe, as they say, and without ick, teach them how to make connections in a thoughtful way on LinkedIn and start conversations so that when it time when the time comes for you to apply, they know you belong in that room.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

Is there a strategy around just like starting with just commenting, even before you ask for a connection request where you do like a series of commenting on people? Is that something that you encourage kids to do? So that way it's like, oh, okay, they're seeing comments from me and now I'm getting a connection request a week or two weeks or whatever it may be.

SPEAKER_01 14:21

Yeah. So a couple different ways to do that. It depends on the size of the company. So if it's a huge company and they're just re-commenting on company posts, it's very likely that whoever's running that social media for the company is never going to know who this is. So the key is to then definitely comment on the posts of the hiring manager or just like projects that they might be working on. Because people tend to LinkedIn is is a is a bragging platform for sure. Everybody is sharing, hey, look what I did. So that's a perfect opportunity to lean in and not just say, wow, that's amazing, but actually read the article, research what it is that they accomplished, and comment thoughtfully. Wow, I'm so impressed by the money you've

LinkedIn Visibility Without The Ick

SPEAKER_01 15:05

raised to fund XYZ. What an incredible opportunity for your industry or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 15:10

I do.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Yes. Because then that hiring manager is, oh wait, who's that? And they may not comment, they may not respond at all, but you continue, you persist.

SPEAKER_02 15:21

Yeah. And is there, I guess there's probably good ways to stand out with your commenting because LinkedIn is very much I'm pleased to announce, or I'm humbled to be honored, or is I think there's probably better ways to make it happen. So, what are a couple of tricks there that you've you've found along the way with kids? For just commenting or either sharing information about things they've worked on in college or commenting.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

Yeah. So in theory, their best situation is they have an internship. But if that didn't happen for them, which is okay, it doesn't mean it's doomsday and they're never going to get a job. So I want to make that very clear. If your kid did not have an internship, they're still going to get a job, but they have to go about it the right way. So they can rely on projects that they've worked on from in school, different things that they've done, something that they're contributing to in a professional club. If it's a philanthropy that you're raising money for, I I don't want to see you post about the party you just raged at. That's absolutely inappropriate, obviously. But if it's something that could be at all a professional contribution, yes, absolutely share that. I'm proud to announce and I'm I'm happy I was a part of this experience, and this is what we raised, and do it in a thoughtful way.

SPEAKER_02 16:36

I think that's great. It's a great starting point for kids, for sure. I I know too, probably like when we're talking about sharing information on LinkedIn, it's like very like this. I did this project, I did this internship, it's very like hard skill-esque.

unknown 16:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 16:53

But where do soft skills play into the process?

SPEAKER_01 16:56

Yeah. Okay. So first of all, uh, Gen Z is like salmon swimming upstream in terms of so many companies are so leery to hire them because the work ethic seems to be a bit of an issue. And the communication seems to be a bit of an issue, the following instruction, the professionalism. So I feel like it's more important that now than ever to highlight those skills. Almost basically that where Gen X excels is where Gen Z kind of needs to fill in the gap of I am good at this. Because unfortunately, so many employers are very frustrated. They don't even know how to write a professional email because they're so used to their Snapchat world or their text world. Yeah. Where so I feel like those soft skills are important to mention as well as just making sure that that employer knows that you are hardworking and reliable and you're willing to learn and you're not offended and all of those things that seem so basic, but I feel like they're so important for Gen Z now, especially because they are labeled as that. And it's unfortunate. Because of course that never applies to everyone. There's always exceptions. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 18:16

Absolutely. So if you could for the A, you work with grads, not their parents, make it clear. Yes. B, walk us through a scenario, if you will, of somebody that came to you where they were when they first got to you, the couple of things that you did and where they ended up.

SPEAKER_01 18:33

Yeah. So I worked with a student that graduated Magna Cum Loud, super impressive young lady. Um, uh, four years, great degree, the whole deal, checks all the boxes, didn't have any real significant internships, came home thinking I'm gonna figure it out, and went, oh shoot, nothing's working. I happened to be friends with her mom, and so I was hearing all this through her mom. And I said, I don't understand. What how is this girl not hired? This is unbelievable to me. And I said, Listen, let me see her resume. So I lifted her resume. The resume was tragic because she just didn't know how to format it. And I later learned that she learned none of that in college. She never got any lesson at all in her major of how do you compose a resume ever. The resume needed a lot of help, but also she had no idea, again, how to make herself visible. So she was applying and applying and applying and getting nowhere. So what I did was I taught her how to get on the radar of these different hiring managers at the companies that she was interested working for. We drilled it down to a few companies. She started making connections, making conversations. Well, all of a sudden, a role came up that was an entry-level role. And before they even posted the role, they were like, hey, we need somebody to fill this role. Would you like to apply? So that is really the best situation. Yeah, that's

Resumes That Show Proof Not Tasks

SPEAKER_01 19:56

because I will tell you that over and over again, entry-level jobs are not being posted. They're being hired from either within or through somebody that's already known. So it's really critical that students are not just applying into a black hole, but are focusing their effort on making connections so that when things are available, you are the one they're thinking of. So anyway, she ended up getting hired. And unfortunately, the company ended up doing massive layoffs two months later. But the point was is she learned how to do this so that she was able to pivot and get herself into a new role the same way.

SPEAKER_02 20:32

Yeah, she learned a skill set in order to make it happen quicker. Correct the apply more rapidly. Yeah, because apply more is does not work. It doesn't work. Yeah, it's being it's being like surgical, it sounds like very focused.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

It absolutely is being, yes, yes. And often parents will say, My kid is so incredible. They went to a D1 school, they're a D1 athlete, magna cum loud, and economics major, whatever it may be, and they've applied to 200 positions and haven't gotten any interviews. And I'm like, but what else are they doing besides applying? Nothing. It's just not the way it was for us. Yeah, you can't just apply it.

SPEAKER_02 21:09

And also there's two million graduates a year.

SPEAKER_01 21:12

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 21:13

And so if you take the people who are magnicum loud, and then you that that's still a couple thousand kids with the same parameters and skill set that your child has.

SPEAKER_01 21:25

Right.

SPEAKER_02 21:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

And no doubt your kid is special, but we need to make sure somebody else sees it.

SPEAKER_02 21:31

Okay. For for helping parents through this next step is like, all right, kids are graduating, they're 22, maybe 23. When an employer looks at that, what are they looking for that a parent might overlook because we just don't know because we haven't applied for jobs in forever.

SPEAKER_01 21:47

You mean on paper or what they're looking for in an interview?

SPEAKER_02 21:51

Both on paper, and then once they get in the door.

SPEAKER_01 21:54

In the world of AI that we live in, everybody is using AI for their resume. Everybody knows it. Okay, so some large companies are scanning to see did they use AI and if they did, we don't like it, which in my opinion is ridiculous because for gosh sakes, it's a new, it's it's a new easy way to do it. And if it makes the resume look good, just do it. But my point is is that it's now considered resumes are often in a lane of AI slot, okay? Is the best way to explain that. Students will say on their resume, you know, all these they will give job duties instead of job accomplishments. So the first thing that they're gonna be looking for is don't tell me what you did, tell me how you did it when okay. So let me give you a super basic example. So a lot of students have restaurant work. Okay, they've all worked bartenders' restaurants. It's very common. Even the ones that have no professional experience, they typically have restaurant experience. I see this often. This kid doesn't know what they want to do. They have a four-year degree, they're a great student, and they worked at BJ's pizzeria the whole time they were in college. Now, they don't want to just see things like, oh, I worked at this restaurant 40 hours a week and I seated tables and I cleared this and I did that. They want to see I increased every check 20% by upselling appetizers at these tables. I was promoted to management by creating a new training program for my for new hires, and I offered to XYZ train these people. Anything that you can show that is a metric of an accomplishment is valued on paper, no doubt. Because that's going to make you look much more accomplished, even when you haven't had professional experience. So, yes, that's the nuance there. And then in person, and this one might sting, but parents, you cannot go to the interview. And unfortunately, they are going to the interviews.

SPEAKER_02 23:55

I hear that more and more.

SPEAKER_01 23:57

And let me break that down because I know some parents must be thinking, There's no way parents are going to interviews. Driving your child to the interview and waiting in the lobby still counts as going to the interview. It's completely inappropriate. Your child will never be considered, and you cannot

Interview Rules Parents Must Not Break

SPEAKER_01 24:15

do it. Hard stock. So that is something that's very important. Also, the other thing is the students need to make sure that they are dressed professionally. If everybody in the company is wearing a suit, you cannot show up in a polo shirt and slacks. I'm sorry. You have to wear a suit. So those are the multiple disconnects that I see. In fact, I just saw a CEO recently on LinkedIn, in fact, talk about how they he overlooked a phenomenal option for an internship for their company because he wasn't dressed appropriately. And so in the comments, everybody's like, how was he dressed? And he goes, Well, he was wearing a button-down shirt and slacks, and we wear full suits here.

SPEAKER_02 24:55

Okay, it goes back to the research piece, right? The tactical, the absolutely understanding. Yes. And I would imagine if you put the time and effort, the same amount of time and effort to clicking apply now a hundred times, right? Same time and effort into two very strategic, your odds are probably better.

SPEAKER_01 25:16

100%, Jay. That's why I say let's find a few target companies with roles that would apply to you that are in your wheelhouse and that you want to do, and let's learn everything you can about them. Literally do a deep dive, research them like it's your job. So learn everything you can about them, their employees, their culture, what they've accomplished, read their press releases, Google, everything. And I also really encourage students to hone in on small business. You can learn so much working at a small business for your first job. But so many students would rather work for giant companies, but it's not always the best starting point. And you not only can learn a lot from small business, but you typically tend to avoid massive layoff issues as well when those things come down because small business doesn't tend to overhire.

SPEAKER_02 26:10

Yeah. Well, you also probably tend to learn more.

SPEAKER_01 26:13

Yes, because it's more intimate.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

You can have better quality of conversations around what you'd like to do, where your focus is. And once you have the experience, it's that much easier. Correct. Well, you still do the strategies you learned about hiring managers, but then you have a history to say, here are some things and here's some metrics, right?

SPEAKER_01 26:33

Look what I've done. Yes. Not to mention the fact that small business is easier to nurture than big business.

SPEAKER_02 26:40

They're having trouble finding a job, or maybe they came home, they had a job, but now they're back in the house and they're struggling to launch, if you will.

SPEAKER_01 26:47

Yes. Failure to launch, yes.

SPEAKER_02 26:49

Failure to launch. What's the first conversation they should have with their children tonight?

SPEAKER_01 26:54

Kids are like, I'm not, this isn't my passion. This isn't what I want to do forever. We're not looking for a passion or forever. We're looking for a start. We just need momentum. We need the ball to roll. Because what I tell students all the time is we're looking for 12 to 18 months where you can land. That's it. You don't have to be there forever. You can bounce in 12 to 18 months if you hate it, but you gotta start somewhere. Okay. So maybe you have to lower the bar a little bit on what your expectations are, or maybe you have to think out of the box. Like I mentioned previously, oftentimes students go, but I still don't know what I want to do. And that's okay. But again, we're not looking for a passion project. We're just looking for momentum and a start somewhere. So we just need to get the ball rolling and get hired. Like I said, target those companies and find things that way. Yes. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 27:46

The 12 to 19 months piece is interesting to me because when we were coming up, it was like you get a job and you keep it for a while. You don't are hump and it's it's changed. Tell me more. What does that look like?

SPEAKER_01 27:57

Yeah. So basically, we used to be rewarded for longevity and we got raises based on, oh, you're so loyal, you've done such a good job, you've been here 25 years. That's a that's a non-existent thing anymore. Basically, people are bouncing or leaving their jobs every three to five years minimum with giant pay increases. That's the only way they're able to really get to the next level of pay is by leaving the company. It's shocking, but it's the way the world has changed.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

Is that more because of uh of hybrid remote situations or people actually changing physical jobs and going into different offices?

SPEAKER_01 28:36

Like, oh no, they're first of all,

Momentum Over Passion For First Jobs

SPEAKER_01 28:40

let me just back up to say I highly encourage Gen Z to work in an office and not work from home. Highly encourage. They're gonna get so many skills and so much, so learn so many social cues that they didn't get because remember, this generation was COVID and all the things. So anytime they have the opportunity to be in an office, 100% recommend it. But I would say that it really just depends on the role or the company. I still see a lot of companies offering hybrid or work from home or flexible schedules in that regard. But it just seems that you can't just go ask for a promotion or a raise anymore. It's like you really just have to leverage yourself into a new position in a new company in order to grow wild.

SPEAKER_02 29:21

Interesting. Interesting.

SPEAKER_01 29:22

So in fact, I read, oh, sorry. No, go for it. I read recently that Amazon in particular, Jeff Bezos, doesn't keep anybody like in his in his corporate world longer than four years.

SPEAKER_02 29:35

Which makes because of ideation and innovation.

SPEAKER_01 29:39

It does, but I just look at it and go, you gotta retrain people every four years. That sounds like a nightmare. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 29:46

Because it's so costly to hire people. Yeah, I I would imagine where it is and what level.

SPEAKER_01 29:51

Sure, yes, yes, yes. But yes, so people are leaving sooner than we ever did.

SPEAKER_02 29:59

What you before I let you go, because it's fascinating, and I hope parents take a ton away from it.

SPEAKER_01 30:05

Oh, sure. My pleasure.

SPEAKER_02 30:07

What's one piece of advice you could give to parents about their kids and then also one directly to the kids?

SPEAKER_01 30:15

Yeah. So the advice I would give to parents is you are gonna pigeonhole yourself into a nagging role if you are constantly saying, did you apply? Have you reached out? What have you done? My suggestion would be to hire help as soon as you can. This is not an intuitive process. If they didn't have a job before they graduated, it's not just going to land in their lap now that they're home. It's gonna be harder now that they're home. So the sooner you can intervene and hire help to teach them how to do it effectively, the better off you'll be, the better your relationship will be. But the problem is, is they've been living away for four years and now they're really adults home. So they don't want to hear what you have to say. So the sooner you can have somebody help and mitigate that for you, the better every the happier everyone will be. And then as far as the student goes, I would say, like I said, really, it's okay if you don't know what you want to do. And it's okay if you've been applying aimlessly into a black hole. Today, stop applying and start focusing on where you want to work and research those five to ten companies like it's your job and make it your mission to start engaging with them so that you can be known when roles come up.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

I this just popped in my head because I'm super curious. Is did you start grads hired as a result of your experience with your kids applying, or did you see it beforehand and you had it going before they went down that path?

SPEAKER_01 31:50

Yeah, so great question. A student I shared with you initially, my friend's daughter, she was the reason I started because I went, wait, this amazing kid can't get hired? How is this possible? And then I started talking to all my other friends that had an old kid that was a few years older than mine, and I they all were saying the same things. Yeah, can't get hired. I would hear, I'd walked out of Pilates the other day, and this woman said, Oh, my son graduating from Cal Poly Slow. I think I mentioned this to you, Jay, and he's an engineer and he's coming home and he's gonna work at Nordstrom. And I'm like, What? Yeah. So this is a common denominator. It's it's shocking to the system because as the Gen X parents that we are, we had none of this. So this is so wildly out of our wheelhouse. So it's unexpected. Plus, there's the whole layer of my kid went to a great school and they're so smart and they're so amazing. It's all true. They are all of those things, but nobody knows they exist. That's the problem. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 32:49

Yeah, and and and making it easy for them to show up and become uninvisible, if you will.

SPEAKER_01 32:57

Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, getting it.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

If your parents open the door a crack for you.

SPEAKER_01 33:06

That's the best. If you have that's honestly what I start every consultation with is let's talk about all your resources because that is your lowest hanging fruit. What resources do you have and what have you done about any of it? And usually what I hear is, oh, my mom has this contact or my dad has this contact, but I didn't really know what to say, so I never did anything. Well, we're gonna start there because that's a really good starting point. And that port that person already knows your parent. So you already have an in in that regard. We just have to teach you to walk through that door.

SPEAKER_02 33:35

Do you work with anybody who's they've been in the job market, let's say for five years

Final Advice And Where To Find Help

SPEAKER_02 33:40

and they're like ready to pivot?

SPEAKER_01 33:43

I've really niche down to new grads because I feel like there is so much need here. And um I'm on the pulse of all things, new grad and what is working for them and what isn't, and what hiring managers are frustrated with or happy with. So I just feel like that next level is more out of my wheelhouse.

unknown 34:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:04

But it's good to be focused and going, oh no, my child is at this point, but it sounds like Deborah is really focused on kids just coming out of school, probably within the last 12 to 18 months, get them where they need to be.

SPEAKER_01 34:17

The one disclaimer I will say to that is I am working with clients right now who graduated three years ago and haven't been able to get a job in three years. And when I had, so that is still what I would consider a new grad because they haven't launched yet. I just am not gonna be the right person for I'm ready for my second or my third job. That's you're gonna need a different career coach for that. But these kids have been out three years, hadn't launched yet. They're devastated. Our initial consult, they were sobbing. They're so frustrated. So it's devastating. And I feel terrible. It's that's so long to be home and in your old room. And you and I said, Do you want to be able to move out? Is that your goal? And they're like, Yes, we want to move out.

SPEAKER_02 35:04

Yeah, I think when you said three years, I think I heard the audience collectively go, you know, like have a mini heart attack. But it's happens because that's the norm of how the hiring goes today.

SPEAKER_01 35:17

Followed with the parents thinking they're gonna come home and I'm air quoting here, figure it out, because they won't figure it out when they come home without without help. They won't.

SPEAKER_02 35:27

Yeah, so good. Deborah, thank you so much for sharing a lot about what you do. I know that it's super helpful to folks, and my goal is to make sure that they know the resources you have available. So where can they find you online if they're like, oh god, I need Deborah's help.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

It's gradshired.com. So it's just d g-r-a-d-s-h-i-r-ed.com, gradshired. Maybe you can include that in your show notes. And then also I'm on LinkedIn and you can message me on LinkedIn or find me through my website. In fact, on my website, I have a book a free consultation. Book one, let's have a conversation, let's see where your kid is at, and let's just see if I can be of any help for you. So that's an easy way to go.

SPEAKER_02 36:12

There's an easy way for your kids to start networking, is just go find Deborah on LinkedIn and have a conversation.

SPEAKER_01 36:18

Yes, start there. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 36:19

Networking step one, done.

SPEAKER_01 36:22

Yes, exactly. Love it. Touche.

SPEAKER_02 36:24

I love it. All right. Thank you so much, Deborah. Appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 36:26

My pleasure. Thank you, Jay.