The Empty Nest Home Question

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Perhaps the children have left and now it's okay. What does li life look like now? Do we need this big house? Do we need five bedrooms and a huge yard that I need to maintain? That kind of thing. So it goes up into the eight areas of the wheel of life. And then you go through a series of questions for each of the eight areas to really hone in on what would be the ideal home for you. It's it and the the remaining question is do you stay, go, or reno?

SPEAKER_00 0:27

Welcome to this empty nest life, the podcast dedicated to helping you embrace this transformative season with purpose, passion, and joy. In each episode, we explore stories, strategies, and insights to help turn your empty nest into an exciting new chapter. Whether you're redefining your identity, pursuing new passions, or finding peace in the pause, you're in the right place. Here's your host, the empty nest coach, Jay Ramsden.

SPEAKER_02 0:50

Hey there, my emptiness friends. Are you ready to downsize, maybe move, but you just can't answer the question, how do I even start aligning my new lifestyle with the perfect home? Today I'm joined in studio with Kim Costa, author of the upcoming book, Live in Your Wheelhouse. It's coming out March 24th of 2026. And I'm so excited to have Kim here. She is a top-performing real estate agent in the Atlanta area, and she understands the significance of greeting spaces that reflect who we are and support our growth. And today we're going to dive into all of that and more. And I can't wait to get into the magic of it. Kim, welcome to this empty nest life.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Thank you so much. I appreciate you having me. I'm looking forward to our conversation.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

You were intriguing when you reached out because I there's something about people at this time in life, right? We're looking to maybe downsize or move or find a new location. You're really focused on what does the, I don't want to say right home, but the home that fits us and perhaps our lifestyle and our personality comes to life. Is that accurate?

SPEAKER_01 1:57

Very much. And and it it may not be the you from five or 10 years ago, because as empty nesters, we we know our kids fly, fly the nest as they should, and that we're all hoping for that. And then it's like my gosh, who who am I anyway, if I'm not the mom or the dad or someone who's getting towards the end of their career. So it's now it's time for me. What who am I anyway?

SPEAKER_02 2:22

That's right. Who am I anyway? What do I want to do?

SPEAKER_01 2:25

Where was I?

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Where was I? Exactly. I know I was speaking to somebody and recorded another episode with someone else who's actually downsized all the way to a tiny home. Yes. So that was an interesting conversation. But you take a look at it now that we're trying to figure out who we are, we might feel like we're even stuck in the house that we're in or feel like we have to stay, or something along those lines. But what are some common signs that you find that people are like, no, that this space is no longer aligned with either who I want to be or how I want to live my life now?

SPEAKER_01 2:56

I think there's a general feeling, either when you walk in the door or you're heading home and you might feel a little sad. You may walk in the door and it's so quiet. Like I'm tears in my eyes, like forming, even though I don't live in my old home anymore. That oh my gosh, where are my kids? Where, where's the dog? The things that you just used to occupy all of your time. It's an underlying feeling of like something's off, something's missing, and that there's more to life that is just a void that hasn't been filled yet. It's like the in-between that you have to figure out like, what does the next 20, maybe 30 years look like where I can finish out the rest of my life doing the things I want to do, maximizing my potential, and maybe even helping other people.

SPEAKER_02 3:40

Okay. So my my brain immediately goes to like rhythm, energy, and joy, like in the house where we raise the kids, there's all this amazing energy. There's a rhythm to it. They start to leave and trickle off, and then that rhythm and energy changes. And sometimes the answer may be even moving into a new home.

SPEAKER_01 4:01

Yeah. Yeah. And that's a great analogy. I'd never thought of it that way. But you were you were a band. You had a bass guitar, you were the lead guitar, you had drums and maybe some something else, some uh some brass, but little by little all the other supporting characters left, and it's just you playing the guitar left. And it's it doesn't sound as good.

SPEAKER_02 4:21

That's right. It doesn't come together the way that it used to.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

It does no, no, where's the band? So I think it's a matter, a matter of taking what you've got. So, you know, your gifts, your strengths, and thinking about who am I? That's the first part of the process. Myself, one of the four M's, which is the foundation, like the foundation of your house, and then you start the rest of your life from there.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

Okay. So you mentioned the four M's. What are those?

SPEAKER_01 4:47

Okay, so like the if you have a basement or a foundation and there's a crack and it's it's not solid, the four M's are the bait the the foundation of the wheelhouse method. And so the four Ms are myself. Who am I? How was I made? Mastery is what gifts do I have, and what can I really work on to master them? And then the third is mission. What do I apply those gifts to? What's my mission in my life or the next part of my life? It might just be to travel because now you have your freedom, right? And then from there it's mates. So do you have people that surround you that support the real you and your mission in life? So they might be a travel buddy, your your partner, they like to travel, or just the people you invite into your home that support you and really like the real you.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

Oh, okay. And that's all part of the wheel, I think you call it the wheelhouse assessment.

SPEAKER_01 5:43

Yes, that's correct. The wheelhouse assessment.

unknown 5:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:46

Not to be confused with the real housewives, right? The real wheelhouse assessment. Okay. So that's how somebody can identify what maybe perhaps they truly want in a home and in a lifestyle on this next stage. Yeah. And is there does that assessment just instantly say this type of house? Or tell me how that works?

Wheel Of Life And Stay Go Reno

SPEAKER_01 6:03

It's different for everybody, and that's the whole point of it, is that everybody's going to get a different answer because the next part of the wheelhouse method is to go up from the bottom floor. Many people have all those four elements in line and they're living great life. It's just that circumstances have changed. Perhaps the children have left, and now it's okay. What does life look like now? Do we need this big house? Do we need five bedrooms and a huge yard that I need to maintain? That kind of thing. So it goes up into the eight areas of the wheel of life. And then you go through a series of questions for each of the eight areas to really hone in on what would be the ideal home for you. Is it and the the remaining question is do you stay, go, or reno?

SPEAKER_02 6:50

Like that, a little twist in there.

SPEAKER_01 6:52

Yeah.

Keeping Space For Kids Visits

SPEAKER_02 6:52

Stay, go, or reno. It's like fight, flight, or freeze. Yeah. Which one are three choices of response to any situation? But this one happens to be for the home. For the people who are listening, like I can imagine, oh, but five bedrooms, we need them. Because what if the kids come home? And what if, what if, what if?

SPEAKER_01 7:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:11

How do how do people handle that?

SPEAKER_01 7:13

A very good choice would be to stay. And then the of those five bedrooms, one becomes your home office because you're you're doing a podcast, for perhaps in in your case, or maybe you're going to make a bunk room out of one, and that's where the grandkids are going to stay, so that you want the kids to come back. So you may repurpose your current home and do a little remodeling, not necessarily a full-blown renovation, but you may find different functions for some of the rooms that you already have. It could be an art room, it could, like I said, a bunk room, another office, and things like that. I think it's just a matter of repurposing and if the home's really not going to work, if you have a health problem, you have bad knees and the master bedrooms on the second floor, that might involve a move because that's hard to fix.

SPEAKER_02 8:02

Very hard to fix in some instances, unless you're ready to totally gut the home and start over it again. Yeah. I want to make sure who people are listening. If you are thinking about downsizing and going, it doesn't make you a bad parent. If you're looking to make a smaller room and not have as much room for the kids to come visit, it's totally a choice. And I know that I'm sure that's what the whole house assessment plays into. It's like, how does a person's lifestyle impact their experience in their home or their new home? But I I would imagine some of that requires some deep self-reflection, perhaps. How does that play out when you're working with clients?

Maslow Needs Applied To Housing

SPEAKER_01 8:37

I think it's a matter of just really listening to them. Life change is hard. And it's when our kids went off to college or went away, it was a whole transition for us. And now it's another transition deciding what are we going to do the next hopefully 20, 30 years, right? And so it's really about what are your dreams? Like, is are there things you haven't done in your life that you'd like to do? Or what is visiting with your grown children look like? Are you going to travel to see them? Do they have a room for you to stay for three weeks? And so you what does that look like for you? And so you, I'm just thinking, you may not need the big house because it's not that you're not going to see your children. They just want you to come there to watch the grandchildren and stay for three weeks, and they've got a cottage in the back for you. So that may be what your future looks like. So basically, it's just going around the eight areas of the wheel of life, which are health, environment, what you do for fun, romance, career, finance, family and friends, and spirituality. And you go through each a series of questions that go up Maslow's hierarchy, all the needs from physiological, bad needs and things like that, or you can't sleep, to aesthetic needs, which is paint colors and artwork and things like that. And you go through each of the eight areas with those questions up-leveling your lifestyle in each area, not your old lifestyle with three kids in the house, because that has come and gone, but what your new ideal lifestyle is going to look like. Maybe you need to be close to an airport and a lock and leave home so you can leave town and go visit them for three weeks.

SPEAKER_02 10:17

I've so I've never heard that phrase before, a lock and leave home.

unknown 10:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

Yeah. Okay. So I love that you took kind of the the life wheel and the hierarchy of needs and tied it into assessment for for homes and picking out, like me, perhaps the perfect new home. How did that even come to you?

SPEAKER_01 10:36

That's a good question. It took a while. I have always been obsessed with people's potential and homes. My parents were both human resource executives. So the dinner conversation was who was good at this job and what this person's personality was. So I grew up with that and I was fascinated with homes. So years and years of just getting design work and human human resource development master's work, and then becoming a realtor, it just all came together. All these things I'd been studying for decades, I was like, that's interesting. I'm starting to classify people into eight, the eight different areas of the wheel of life. This person is having a finance and family move, and that person is having a career and entertainment move. And then I went a little, I kind of mold that around and ask people questions. And then I said, I've always loved Maslow's hierarchy. And I thought, how can we really hone in on how to grade each area from one to 10? And I thought, oh, the the the seriousness of the need. Is it a need to, if you can't sleep, that's a deeper need than I don't like my paint color?

SPEAKER_02 11:47

So good. Brilliant, Kim. Really to take what's at the core of people in their lives always and tying it how to figure out and tying it to how to figure out where do we live? What does it look like? Is it the current home? Is it something new? Do we just need to tweak what we have? Not literally open up the doors to some of these categories so they rate higher for us.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

Right. It's just clarifying.

SPEAKER_02 12:12

I love that you're like, oh, it's just clarifying. You make it sound so easy.

SPEAKER_01 12:17

It's a system to clarify. It's a structure to put all your wants, needs, and dreams into living the rest of your life. And then having a place to operate out of, not only operate out of, but supports you and expresses who you are.

Client Story: Lock And Leave Living

SPEAKER_02 12:31

Oh, okay. So in my work, I I I deal with life transitions, like the big questions, what's now and what's next? And so I would imagine, like you, you probably see this as an opportunity for maybe some personal growth, maybe reflection, maybe even on a reinvention. How's that played out for some of your clients?

SPEAKER_01 12:50

Oh my gosh, I have some great stories about that. I've got yeah, I just dish a little. So happy. Of course, names withheld, stories change slightly. Like I don't dish publicly about people's private information. They would never trust me again. So um, so just hypothetical, but something maybe many people have experienced. A fella who had got was divorced for many decades, but kept a family home in the school system close to his former spouse to have the kids there. Large home in a a development with like swim tennis, all the things you have when you're a family. The kids got married and moved away and started having grandchildren. And he's a retired executive and he could pretty much do whatever he wanted to do. And he wasn't the people, older people were moving out of the neighborhood, and he likes to travel. He wants to go see his kids. They weren't staying at the house anymore. It was a lot of maintenance. He spent his weekends cleaning up the yard and it he was bored and a little lonely. And so he decided, or we decided, he needed a place more towards the town where he could just lock and leave again, lock and leave, and he could walk into the town and have coffee or dinner with friends that he'd known for a long time. And then he could hop on a plane and go see his family and his grandkids that are multiplying now. And he's so happy. I get I'm friends with him on social media and I I get to see like the new grandchildren, and he bought a second home elsewhere, and he spends the off season in at his second home, and he's just so happy. And I just love that just that change in environment freed him up to do all the things he's wanted to do.

Avoiding New Problems After A Move

SPEAKER_02 14:28

Yeah, I love that. That he's that's a perfect example of anybody who's looking to do it do this, is what's going to make you happy in the long run? And what does that look like? And I love what you said. It was like a career and fun move or a career and recreation move or whatever those combinations in in the life wheel that would work for somebody to be like, ah, that's it. Yes. That's it. Do do people know that's it when they come to you? Or is that like you help them figure that out along the way?

SPEAKER_01 15:01

They know the main reason, the pain, the main pain point that they're having. Maybe it's a health issue and they they can't main maintain the home like they used to. I hear that quite a bit. Maybe it's, gosh, my family lives in Minnesota. Maybe I need to move to Minnesota. There's good health care, so that's a health family move. And maybe financial, maybe they're a lot of their retirement is tied up in the home. And it's a large home, a nice home in in our particular area. You could sell that for one, two million dollars. And that just adds to the nest egg of a simplified lifestyle. So there you have financial, family, and health. All the those are the main reasons. But what they may not consider is what do they like to do for fun? The environment in Minnesota is cold. Are you okay with that? All the other things. So even though they know they want to move or they're thinking about making a change for one or two reasons, you really need to go through the rest of the of the wheel so that you don't create a different problem.

SPEAKER_02 16:34

Great point. You wouldn't want to cry by decide I'm gonna move, and then all of a sudden you find yourself almost stuck again.

One Practical Step To Start

SPEAKER_01 16:41

Oh, I want to live with my kids in, I don't know, we're gonna say remote Iowa or somewhere cool like Idaho, anything like that. But they're getting older and they didn't take into consideration, oh yeah, I have some health conditions and the nearest hospital is an hour away and there's no medical care. And so it just so there are questions to prompt, do you have a health condition? Do you need a an elevator? Would do you like to garden? Things like that.

SPEAKER_02 17:05

Understood. Okay, so I can see where this is kind of like there's people might be saying, Where um there's a lot here, right? There's a lot in this wheelhouse, and and how do I even start the process of aligning what would be one practical step they could do right now if they're thinking about it, but they're not sure even where to start?

Kim’s Downsizing Trial And Error

SPEAKER_01 17:24

I think it is just pushing the pause button before they make any decisions and deciding what does like a maybe even a mental vision board, what does my perfect life look like? Is it at the beach? Is it at the mountains? Is it in the city? Is it just like in general, what makes them happy? Is it two homes? Is it is it downsizing and getting an investment property and going there part-time? And so it sounds very complicated, but the book is all inclusive. It has to have questions for everybody. There are questions in the assessment that people will be like, that that doesn't apply to me or it doesn't matter. But there are going to be some other questions that it's oh my gosh, I hadn't, I hadn't thought about that. I need to consider that and I'm gonna rate this area differently now and put that on my list of what I need. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 18:14

So let's make this a little bit more real for them.

SPEAKER_01 18:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:17

And you said like you're not in your the family home anymore. You've downsized.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

Right, several times.

SPEAKER_02 18:23

Several, several times. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 18:25

And then back up one. But I downsized too much, and then I came back up one.

SPEAKER_02 18:29

All right, tell me, tell us about that journey. So you get a handle on your own personal experience.

SPEAKER_01 18:34

Sure, sure. So when my kids were going off to college, I lived in a very large home. I don't know, it had seven bathrooms and six, six or seven bedrooms, and a pool and a basement kitchen, all and a theater, all the things, right? Just a big, big home, lots of maintenance. And then the kids went off to school and a lot of life changes. So I downsized to a town home. And then I was like, okay, this is still pretty big. It's like 4,000 square feet. It's got four bedrooms, and so then I went to a two-bedroom luxury apartment in this place called Avalon in Alpharetta. Super fancy, fun. Restaurants, walk downstairs, go to a great restaurant, shopping, all concerts outside, great fun. And then I was like, I think I can do a one bedroom. So I did a one bedroom and I was like, oh no, I have nowhere for my kids. And then COVID hit. So the both my kids are like on my couch and in my place, um, because they were at school and they came home. And I was like, Yeah, this is not working. So then I bumped back up.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

But back up to a two-bedroom.

SPEAKER_01 19:38

So I I took the scenic route.

SPEAKER_02 19:40

Okay, but I love that it's a it's like an example for people to see. It's like it's not, it doesn't have to be a one and done.

SPEAKER_01 19:46

No, you can you can change your mind again. If you you can try something, plenty of people move to Florida because they think it's the thing to do. And I love Florida, but it can get a little hot for folks moving from a cooler climate, and then they do what's the re what we call the rebound move. It's like back to North Carolina. Yeah. Because it's like still got four seasons, but it's a little milder in the summer.

SPEAKER_02 20:07

That's right. Yeah, we lived in North Carolina for almost 20 years, and we people beautiful, you know, fondly referred to it as the halfback state people in the northeast. Yeah, they went all the way to Florida and then they went halfway back home. Yes. They stopped in North Carolina.

Rent First And The Lifestyle Triangle

SPEAKER_01 20:21

Yeah. So now I'm in a four-bedroom cottage style home. The the yard and everything is maintained for me because I like to travel. So it's uh, and I have a garden, so I like have a little uh mut enough of a yard that's low maintenance that I can still enjoy the outdoors and a covered front porch that because I I like that, but I don't have to maintain it. So it's it took me personally a little trial and error until to find the right thing. And now I'm like, this is it. It's I'm I'm here.

SPEAKER_02 20:51

Do you ever recommend to people perhaps going, let's say they're in a in the in a family home, whatever size it may be, and they're looking to downsize maybe to a one-bedroom or a two-bedroom. Do you recommend going and doing like an Airbnb or renting for a while in a situation like that?

SPEAKER_01 21:07

Absolutely. Completely. If you feel like you want to go live at the beach, maybe rent something for six months or a year, because you don't know what community you want to be in. You don't know the little like where you're going. If you work out somewhere, like how far is that? Do you like that gym or uh place that you worship? You want to be in the triangle of the things you do the most. You want to be in the middle of that if you can. And so I re I highly recommend renting somewhere first or visiting for a couple of years before you make the move.

SPEAKER_02 21:37

I so I that that idea of being in the middle of a triangle of the things you do most. That I've never heard it explained that way before.

Handling Pushback And Owning Change

SPEAKER_01 21:46

I got it from I like to cook. And so I got it from the work triangle in the kitchen. In the kitchen. What's the refrigerator, the sink, and the stove, I believe. So the triangle, the wheelhouse triangle is work typically. Work, unless you're retired. So it's the three things you do the most. It could be the gym, the church, and the job, or the kids' school, whatever you do. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:10

Well, so for empty nesters, it could be whatever it may be, right? Whatever activities you love to do.

SPEAKER_01 22:15

Yeah. Yeah. The community center.

SPEAKER_02 22:19

Whatever.

SPEAKER_01 22:20

Yeah, the restaurants, the gym, and the hiking you like to do.

SPEAKER_02 22:24

So it you just brought in the design piece again from homes. Yeah. The triangle, the kitchen. So good. All right. So through this journey of yours. I'm sure you like we talked about what you went from big to small to smaller, back a little bit, developing the wheelhouse assessment, working with people. What's one thing you've learned about yourself in the journey?

SPEAKER_01 22:45

Gosh, I think I've really honed in on what makes me comfortable. And you learn by trial and error sometimes, and that's okay. And I've learned that I am just really happy to be myself. And once I set up my environment to really focus on my strengths and what makes me happy, that it just I don't really need to explain that to anybody. Like when you go through change, sometimes you get a little pushback from people because they're just used to be you being even your own children, they're used to you being like mom, mom and dad or mom or dad, they're in Europe like three months out of the year. What can't they just come watch our kids and and be the old mom and dad, the reliable mom and dad we knew for all those years? Mom and dad are having fun. Let them. And but you might you might get a little pushback, and that's okay. They will adjust and they will be happy for you.

Investigate Neighborhoods Like A Local

SPEAKER_02 23:43

Yeah. It's true. Like whenever we evolve and change, and no matter what it is, right? A move or personal development or whatever it is, like you're always gonna get pushback from from strangers, from friends, and even from family.

SPEAKER_01 23:56

Yeah. And resistance from yourself.

SPEAKER_02 23:59

Oh, of course. Yes. Of course. Yeah. For somebody who's putting off that big I'm gonna back that up. Not big. For somebody who's who's who's putting off maybe thinking about moving or downsizing. I don't want to scare people and say it's big, because it doesn't have to be. Right? What's kind of one tip to be like, yeah, here's where you can start. You talked a little bit about it before, but just to to reinforce that for people.

SPEAKER_01 24:25

I think you need to investigate other people living that lifestyle. Talk with them a little bit. Go talk with people in the neighborhood you're thinking of moving to, whether it's a high-rise condo or like a community around the corner that's got the zero lot line or a small yard, or just go talk to people and see what they like to do. Like you might discover they play card games on Saturdays and they all get together to watch the football game, and there's water aerobics, and you can't get any of that where you're living. It's you maybe you don't have something like that available. So I think it's just picturing yourself in the environment that you're thinking of and talking with people and doing some investigating of what that's going to look like for you. And then it doesn't become so scary. There might be some things like, oh, I I I would love to go to those community things or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

Okay, so do your homework. Do your homework.

SPEAKER_01 25:15

Yeah, do your homework. I'd like to walk to that restaurant and uh just go sit and observe sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 25:20

Yeah, grab a coffee and just watch.

Kim’s New TV Show And Where To Watch

SPEAKER_01 25:22

Yeah. Could be downtown and you you observe the the demographics of the people in the area. And if you're sitting in the restaurant and you you're thinking you want to move downtown to walk to restaurants, go to the go to the restaurant and just pick up a conversation. Sit up at the bar and get some dinner and ask people like, hey, where do you live? How do you like living down here? All the things.

SPEAKER_02 25:43

All the things. Get get get the inside scoop on what's going on. Exactly. So good. You've done a lot of stuff. You're you're working, you've got the book that's coming out in March. And what's one of the biggest motivators in your life right now? Beyond the book, obviously that's coming, so that's your focus. But what else is one of your biggest motivators in life right now?

SPEAKER_01 26:04

I I have started hosting a TV show called American Dream TV. And so I get to go interview people in my community. It's a positive news show. And so I am going to interview, I've done one episode already, it's airing in December, later in December. And then the next one will come out in February. So I'll be going to my favorite bookstore and interviewing the owner. And so that kind of ties in the whole community spirit of people doing good and like why my community is great. And then it because I'm a people person, it's a great end to meet some really cool people, like podcasting, getting a conversation with people.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

Yeah, I love this. It's so much fun. I get to meet a lot of different people doing a lot of different things. Yeah. But all in the same stage and place of life. And it's always my whole people are listening and they're gleaming something from every single person that comes on the show. But where that show that you're talking about, where you're going to interview people in your community, where where will people be able to find that?

SPEAKER_01 27:02

So you can find it on like Apple TV, Roku, CNBC. Some of the episodes get to be on HGTV and the travel channel. And so that's my my aspiration. I'll have to really work hard to get on those particular channels. But you can, there's also this also on YouTube. So if you just punch in American Dream TV on YouTube, you can see all the episodes.

SPEAKER_02 27:27

Oh, that is awesome.

SPEAKER_01 27:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:29

I love that concept of being able to kind of tie what you're doing in life to your community so people can get a glimpse on what's going on. Is it just where you live or will it expand out from there?

Dreaming Bigger And Closing Message

SPEAKER_01 27:41

It has, it's already expanded. I think there are something like five or six hundred realtors across the nation that actually interview people and have positive news in their own communities. So it's a group of you have to be asked to do it. And so they research you a little bit and make sure you have a real positive spin and you're doing good things in the community, and that you you post videos so that they know you're good on camera.

SPEAKER_02 28:07

So good. Folks, that could be homework lesson number one. If you're looking to find a place to live, go watch episodes.

SPEAKER_01 28:13

There you go. Punch in the town into American Dream TV. And there's guaranteed somebody's that's showing you around the town right there on YouTube.

SPEAKER_02 28:22

So good. That's first step, folks. You don't even have to leave your home to begin homework if you're looking to downsize and figure out what comes next for you. As we look to wrap up the show, Kim, I'm I'm wondering what's one thing that you've always wanted to do, but you haven't done yet, especially now in your emptiness life.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

I would love to live abroad for several months. France or Italy or England, I think.

unknown 28:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 28:53

I would love to do that. Let's demonstrate for folks how you how will you narrow that down between those three?

SPEAKER_01 28:58

Well, that's that's gonna be fun because I've been investigating those countries and some I've been to all of them actually so far on little trips 10 days here and there. And that's why I can't decide because I need to go back. I need to go back on some little trips where I investigate and maybe I find a I need to find the right town that's just big enough to have great restaurants, but just small enough so that it's not touristy. And so that's going to take a little more investigation. So I've liked all of the things on Instagram and Facebook, like small towns in South France. And there's there are channels that show you these things. And so I write a little list and I'll go investigate them. And one day when I get closer to real retirement, I'll go take a trip for several months over there.

SPEAKER_02 29:47

Just to examine it all. So what an example, perfect example of how you investigate what maybe come next for you in life. And it's been, I've really enjoyed this conversation, trying to figure out because this is gonna happen for my wife and I here, probably in the next four years, is trying to figure out what comes next for us when we downsize outside of Massachusetts and most likely return home to Raleigh, North Carolina, where our daughter is. And it's been so enlightening for me. I'm gonna take away the triangle piece for sure. That's like the number one thing. But folks, we'll put it in the show notes here where you can pre-order live in your wheelhouse, which will be out here shortly for folks, and it'll be a great first step to figuring out what comes next for you. Kim, thank you so much for joining me here on This Emptiness Life.

SPEAKER_01 30:35

Thank you so much for having me. It's been wonderful.

SPEAKER_00 30:40

Thank you for listening to This Emptiness Life. Remember, this chapter isn't an ending, it's an invitation to redefine, rediscover, and reignite your life. If today's episode sparks something in you, don't forget to take that first step and visit thisemptynesslife.com and click work with me to get the conversation started. Until next time, keep your heart open, your mind curious, and your spirit shining. This Empty Nest Life is a production of Impact One Media LLC, all rights reserved.